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Jesse Adams
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12/28/2009 3:46:06 PM
I hate promo.
I really do. I'm so sick of talking about myself and telling people to check out my music. I don't even care if people listen to my shit anymore... honestly I kind of prefer they didn't in a way because it makes it easier for me to write better music. Nobody is listening, no one to object or criticize... just pure musical freedom for my enjoyment and amusement, like it was when I was a kid. Good times right there.
Maybe if I ever get to that point I'll hire someone to talk about how great my music is. Until then, fuck it.
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Otis and the Professors
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12/28/2009 7:02:00 PM
Yes, I think I could have written this exact same thing. Thank You Jesse.
Btw, I really dig your shit, the freedom you discuss here is evident, it doesn't all hit me the right way, but I admire where you are coming from as a musician, and just hope all this promo bullshit doesn't stop you from creating whatever vision you want.
Peace,
Drewsus
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Kevin White
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12/28/2009 7:17:55 PM
That's my philosophical corner, Jesse. I give my music away for free, and I don't care about the money aspect of it. It costs me money ... and I shrug it as the cost of the hobby.
Music gives me nothing but the enjoyment I get from creating it ... and the joy I get when someone connects with something I've created. I'd rather spend time making music than promoting it though ... so I don't spend much time doing that.
I still craft it with intent that people hopefully will find it appealing, but each and every piece will or won't appeal to whomever on whatever level. That's out of my hands, so it's not something I pay attention to. I do pay attention to the quality of the production, because I feel that serves the art best.
So I just do what I do the way I want to do it and let it go from there.
That's freedom ... and probably obscurity ... but I'm at peace w/ it.
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Tony Vani and Debbie Hoskin
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12/28/2009 8:32:59 PM
I tried the promo thing a couple of times in the beginning; but I totally lost respect for myself when I did it. I felt like it cheapened everything. Perhaps it's because of the nature of what I write about. I felt like I was selling or pushing my private journals on the world. It's just too weird. Perhaps if I wrote about happier things, I'd feel differently.
On the other hand, I'm ok with people who do the promo thing. That's ok for them. I dont' disrespect those who do.
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Conversation Suicide
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12/28/2009 11:30:41 PM
Yes, Self-Promo is kind of ethically, well, fucked up....and definitely SUCKS, as a somewhat necessary activity related to music creation, and "spreading the love", as it were.
BUT GUESS WHAT, even the few folks throughout the world who DO listen to us, probably won't take the time to do promotion for us for FREE...
So that means it's up to li'l ole me. Until something truly magical happens.
-tha's my take on it
HERE's some FREE PROMO for Jesse Adams ==
Mr. Adams robust and diverse tuneage has originality, mixed with GREAT, tasty riffs, and well orchestrated songs, that mostly grab ya by the cajones.
Jesse Adams' music on IAC is some of the BEST, and is heavily played on my stations. Grega Habic is no slouch either, and adds MUCH to the already amazing mix.
ROCK the FUCK on, man. If I ever get anywhere with my music dreams, I'm makin' sure YOUR stuff gets the notice it deserves TOO. But for now, it's self-promo-central. -pHLeGm
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Jeff Allen Myers
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12/29/2009 12:07:31 AM
---- Updated 12/29/2009 12:12:33 AM
Giving Promo efforts a bad name is just stupid....if you want to be heard you need to stick your head out from time to time. I do believe there is a line that can be crossed with over promotion with no sincerity, For example, hit and run carpet bombing a site with no real presence on that site.
If you have a new song, by all means tell people about it, if you have a new album..tell people about it, if you have a song on an album for charity...tell someone about it. How else will it succeed??
If you play music for yourself...Great...If you play to get heard...great...if you do it for both reasons...fricken excellent.
The problem is not the promotion, its the totally desensitized, aloof listening public who really does not care. There are few "real" music lovers out there, and when I run across them it is a pleasure.Music for most is not appreciated...it is consumed like a commodity.This is not true for all, just a large percentage, I agree, most threads highlighting new music is ignored here...and that is a shame.
Don't worry about it Jesse, play music because you enjoy it...don't get bitter. Life is too damn short. I do think that musician/writers.artists have been given a great gift...the creation of music. We cannot control who listens, but we can at least "try" to let them know we have something to offer.
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Jesse Adams
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12/29/2009 11:45:01 AM
Drewsus and Phlegmie, thanks for your kind words, they are greatly appreciated. Kevin I also very much agree with your perspective.
I want to mention I'm not bitter at all... I feared my post would come off that way. I just really don't care to sell myself anymore. I'm not interested in it and find it to be a dreadful bore.
Therefor I will not focus on promo, and just focus on writing and recording good music. I will post up my songs as they come along, but I'm not going to run around all over the net and wave my arms around and tell everybody to check out my stuff.
As Jeff said, MOST people don't pay attention anyways, so I personally just find it a waste of time anymore. I will be focusing on getting my tunes into the hands of the right people, not random listens from random passerby's that seem to only serve the purpose of inflating my ego as well as my stats.
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Auset
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12/29/2009 12:26:15 PM
I love your shit too, Jesse.... : )
And I totally get where you're coming from. I'm terrible at self-promotion. I hate posing for pictures. Blah...
I just want to play music and write songs... throw em out in the world like all the other millions of stars in the sky... let go...
its like planting seeds... if you only plant one and sit around all day promoting that one seed... you'll never have a garden and may even kill the plant in the process. Plant seeds everywhere, don't look back, just plant... something is bound to root, to grow, to feed another's soul. Call and response.
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Jesse Adams
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12/29/2009 12:47:11 PM
Perfectly expressed and very well said Auset. Exactly.
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never never band
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12/29/2009 2:15:04 PM
BUY MY MUSIC YOU FUCKERS!!!!!!!
it's pretty good.
and I need to pay some bills, you fickle bastards.
yer pal,
frater P.
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Jeff Allen Myers
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12/29/2009 2:55:40 PM
"if you only plant one and sit around all day promoting that one seed... you'll never have a garden and may even kill the plant in the process."
True! However I look at Promo as the Water that allows it to grow....no water it simply dies on the vine.
However, too much Promotion is the same as too much water....the plant dies :)
So the key is to find the right amount of promotion (water) that allows the song (Plant) to thrive without pissing people off, annoying them, or getting someone to call you a "Promohound" :)~
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Bümdoser
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12/29/2009 3:09:16 PM
than again, this is a good promo! believe it or not but.......You Can!!!:-) XBOOM
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never never band
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12/29/2009 10:21:42 PM
---- Updated 12/29/2009 10:23:45 PM
the thing is, this is not where you should be promoting your stuff.
It's like trying to sell sand at the beach.
this is maybe MAYBE a good place to get feedback, but really no one seems to be a honest critic here.
But the place to promote your music is by gong out and shaking hands.
Talk to station managers at your local collage radio and public access.
Send your stuff to all songs considered on National Public Radio.
If you have some socially relevent music send some stuff to Thom Hartmanns show
((MUSIC SUGGESTIONS
If you have music suggestions or links, send them to
louise@thomhartmann.com ))
If you're gigging make promo packs and get them to a booking agent, or just go out and meet the managers at the places you want to play.
I'm giving away 5 song cds like they were business cards.
I get them printed locally with simple cardboard wrappers.......
We have a local film festival and I'm out meeting young film makers and handing them discs.
Promoting yourself on this board is a waste of time, communities like this work best if you can just bounce ideas off each other to try to make your stuff better, or to try to get people to collaborate and be creative with each other, but that doesn't seem to work here..
not sure why.
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Conversation Suicide
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12/29/2009 11:41:34 PM
---- Updated 12/29/2009 11:47:44 PM
Everybody's points are well taken.
REALLY dig the "planting seeds" idea, but mostly 'cause I've seen a small spark from a few years ago, chance meeting, blossom into a true fan/listener.
Um....IAC? Naw, it's not the REAL game out there, BUT it IS a small piece of the puzzle, that I choose to still put energies into.
Funniest thing about Jesse's blog regarding his/our frustrations with the waste of time that flailing your arms about, trying to get noticed certainly is:
This blog is promo in itself.
Basically EVERYTHING we do in life, has the potential of gaining listeners, and getting whatever your message might be, out there.
I'd go deeper on this point, but gotta get my ass home to the family.
LOVE y'all. Happy New Year. And again, here's to MAKIN' some waves in 2010
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Otis and the Professors
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12/30/2009 12:20:37 AM
Did I mention we have a new album out on itunes? Soon to be on amazon? All tracks totally free to listen to here on iac? New youtube page?
youtube.com/otisandtheprofessors ?
:-)
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Jeff Allen Myers
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12/30/2009 12:31:42 AM
Thats an interesting point of view Never.....but if that is true it begs the question...what is IAC??? simply a parking ground for tunage? If no one here is interested in hearing indie music, what the hell are they on this board for? I have listened to all of you....
If you did not post on the pipeline, you would just be another lmpersonal lifeless band /artist trying to be heard.
I would not have as many station adds if I did not participate here...I would like to think my music is the main reason...but if I was not visible no one would find me. I think my time here has been a success the way I define it.
Yes, each post is a sort of Promo....and it may draw people to your page to see what you are all about.
There are many sites on the web to be heard,and the competition for "ears" gets harder every day. So my advice is to do it becuae you enjoy it, and not worry about the rest. If you want "real" success you must do what has been pointed out...you must get out and interact, play live, play live again, and interact some more with a cohesive plan.
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Conversation Suicide
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12/30/2009 1:50:46 AM
Otis and The Professors == good on yOU! Great example of somewhat-subtle slip of PROMO, and press release stuff....
Jeff, you're contributions to Jesse's thread here have demonstrated excellent wisdom.
Blogs like this bring out some of the many reasons I keep coming back to IAC.
Real people, with LOADS of Experience, that I learn from AT LEAST once a week.
Cool fairly new post ideas, and twists on old ideas, like This Jesse Adams post; and EXCELLENT chances to be heard and responded to from the BLOGS (unlike pretty much all other music sites).
I'll say it again: even if it IS mostly other musicians and those with the Indie music Hobby, that actual give a few listens to our creations here on IAC....it's STILL a real-world scenario of getting the music out there. It's gotta start somewhere. Why not HERE?
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Kevin White
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12/30/2009 6:12:24 PM
IAC knows exactly what it is ... and it's been a bit of a backwater pool lately, but that's also why management reached out to other sources to generate more interest ... commensurate w/ stripping out dead weight from the rolls ... so that when other interest arrives, it doesn't go WTF???
I think that was exactly the right thing to do.
Frankly, if IAC doesn't remain adept and adapt, the days are numbered by dollars.
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Jeff Allen Myers
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12/30/2009 6:36:25 PM
---- Updated 12/30/2009 6:38:36 PM
The main problem with this site, and sites like it is it is primarily supported by Musician/artists all competing to be heard, Of course many are music lovers first...but until the pure non musician/artist music lover comes to discover new music, there will be struggles.Of course we do have some of those special people here with the only goal of discovering new music...but they are not the majority.
The average music listener is not interested in indie music, they have far too many entertainment choices competing for there attention. So, we should market to the music consumer interested in the undiscovered back roads, and not on the force fed offerings by the conglomerates.
It's a small market, but it is a market.
I hope IAC is successful in getting new eyes an ears to the site, in the mean time we should all be on our best behavior so we do not scare away our new guests :)
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never never band
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12/30/2009 7:11:02 PM
the purpose of this site..I hope...is to market internet radio to the offsite (non indie musician) listening public.
And thats great.
I have always had high hopes for this, but I have some oppinions about how this can really benefit a musician.
I really like the idea of brief spoken song introductions befpore every song.
A voice that says, something like
"This is steve Ianetti with SICK OF ME on IACmusic.com"
this really needs to be there, especially if these streams are going to become syndicated in any way (another hope)
as for the "Artists Community" what the fuck are we doing marketing to each other?
It's one thing to suggest your tune for a particular station I suppose, but really a lot of this is circle jerk.
I would hope that a seperate page could be created where listeners are presented with the top 100 stations or so, maybe more, but none of this chatter and charts and page updates and nonsense. JUST A SITE WHERE THEY ACCESS ONLINE RADIO STREAMS and with the links to our personal pages.
Listeners dont give a damn about what we think of Joe Liberman, or global warming, or what silly shit Banna has to say and it actually cheapens our product I think. Thats our private conversation it seems to me. ( I enjoy it, but I dont want mky music associated to the general public with it, it's unprofessional)
This site here with the Artist area and charts and page updates should not be public. This is a back room of the damn busines, this is where we come up with ideas and argue and hopefully help each other with our music.
ya think?
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Otis and the Professors
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12/30/2009 10:55:56 PM
agreed.
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Jeff Allen Myers
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12/30/2009 11:45:24 PM
---- Updated 12/30/2009 11:47:27 PM
Well the pipeline is set up to share blogs...which are personal thoughts.
Seems to me you are sharing your personal thoughts here as well....so go figure.
It all starts and ends with the listeners, more need to come to the site...to hear individual artists, or stations...whatever, it begins and ends there.
Or it can just be a cool place to host our songs while hanging with like minded musician/artists in a circle jerk (Your words not mine)
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Conversation Suicide
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12/31/2009 12:54:01 AM
---- Updated 12/31/2009 4:36:36 AM
Gawwwddd.... I LOVE the Circle Jerks....
saw 'em with a CRAZY-assed "christian punk" (bwaaah ahhh ahhhhaaa! read: NewWave Lite) band called Daniel Amos....and The Altar Boys teee heee.
It WAS a badass show, though.
The BornAgain Christians were quite frightened by the punks as we moshed about, with an ever widening circle.
Silly, isn't it? Tucson is one weird fuckin' place.
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Magnetfisch
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12/31/2009 4:09:11 AM
@ frater P.:
I dig your honest-and-in-your-face approach of promo 8-)
and agree with you that we're on IAC to celebrate music (rather than discuss about topics that either bore us or exceed one's level of competence: after all, a baker should not argue about an antenna-elevation-motor, should he?)
best wishes, Tim, Magnetfisch
PS: and thanks for the tipp above btw.
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12/31/2009 5:02:50 AM
I hate Romo. :)
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Jesse Adams
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12/31/2009 11:36:31 AM
I do too, he is a douchebag.
GO PACKERS!!!!!!!!!!!
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never never band
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12/31/2009 11:50:36 AM
---- Updated 12/31/2009 11:52:01 AM
"" (rather than discuss about topics that either bore us or exceed one's level of competence: after all, a baker should not argue about an antenna-elevation-motor, should he?)""
tim, dont get me wrong, I actually think all of the political and social discussions and the sillyness is very cool!
I like the way artists think and argue and embellish their ideas with poetic expressions...it's wonderful.
BUT, I dont think it should be the public face of a site,
Really, this should be private forum of the site, not the front page.
Like I said, this is the Backroom of the business, it's great that artists can have a community where they can talk about whatever the hell they want.
I just think that if you're going to market the site listeners should arrive not on this front page, but on a page that is soley dedicated to radio streams without all the other nonsense. We're a bunch of clinky clanky argumentative weirdos, and thats GREAT, but thats not exactly what you want to present as the public face of Independent music.
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Conversation Suicide
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12/31/2009 9:02:14 PM
EAT THIS fuckin' Promo, Frater P. :
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never never band
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1/1/2010 2:14:58 PM
Oh!
You made a poster!
How clever of you.
I wonder why no one has thought of that before.
gret idea too posting it here where everyone who sees it is hundreds or thousands of miles away, and on the very day of the gig!!.......
.thats way smarter than spending some time putting it in every local music store, guitar centers, campus bullitan boards , coffe shops etc.
Your'e really good at this shit
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Otis and the Professors
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1/1/2010 2:57:06 PM
pwned
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Conversation Suicide
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1/1/2010 3:26:36 PM
nope. Frater, I'm not too good at it.
But " I'm gettin' better all the time ", as that faggoty 60's English band that IAC loves so much, had been heard to sing....
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