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Otis and the Professors
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4/2/2009 7:15:03 AM
Any advice for how to arrange/produce on the cheap?
Hey gang, so we are working on a few tunes right now that are just begging for more instruments than we know how to play, and we were trying to think of ways we could get some instruments (strings, flutes, bells, etc) into our music. We are using Sony Acid to record, and the sounds that you can program in with it really suck. If anyone knows of, or uses, anything that might help please let us know. Oh, and hiring a professional to do it is almost certainly out since we have very little money.
We appreciate it. Thanks.
OatP
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4/2/2009 2:24:45 PM
I'm no expert on the subject but I can tell you major albums have been recorded on Garageband but you need more than software to get a large sound. Probably the most impotant innk is a good preamp, tube driver preferably. "The Brick" bu Groove Tubes can be had for 300-400 and you need a good mics too. We got a great sound for both vocals and acoustic guitar with a Neumann TLM-103 but it won't work for every vocalist and there may be better choices for less money that that one cost. You're going to need decet monitors too, a good set of Alesis are 300-400. Check out Yamaha too. They have some great studio monitors on the 300-500 range, probably a better choice than Alesis. Go to Samash.com and see what specials he has on financing. 18 month to pay is not unusual so that would but some of this stuff in reach if money is tight.
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4/2/2009 2:33:03 PM
Whoops, should have read the entire note before responding above but it seem you're just short a good syn-keyboard, there are tons out there that could do the job.
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Kevin White
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4/2/2009 2:50:10 PM
---- Updated 4/2/2009 2:54:50 PM
Aside from Gregg's good advice above, since you want a well rounded versatile recording package, you'll want something that includes top shelf synth sounds to work with.
I'd suggest looking at Cakewalk's Sonar. It's a personal judgment call as to whether Studio or Producer edition would best suit your needs.
If you listen to this song, then you'll hear what can be done almost entirely with the tools provided w/in that application.
I sort of began this as an experiment, to see how deep I could take the program.
It took me ten minutes to put the drum track together in Session Drummer 2, which is included. I did later swap that out for DFHS, because I wasn't satisfied w/ the sound.
I recorded the 12 string guitar w/ a stereo set of MXL603s, which I purchased used for all of $150 for the pair. I ran the mikes through a Peavey VMP stereo tube pre ... also bought used for $450 ... so it's not an expensive chain.
The bass is Roland synth included in the program. The piano: Same Roland Synth. The organ: You guessed it.
The guitar tones are Revalver ... included in the program. All the effects btw ... included in the program.
The vox were tracked via the above Peavey through an AT4050 (bought used, again, $350).
Everything ran through my Layla (bought new years ago for $600, but a two channel input can be had for $100 these days) ... into my computer ... which was the most expensive part of my system ... but similar can now be had for less than 1k.
If you included everything here, you'd have a setup that doesn't far exceed 2k.
That's cheap.
Hope this helps,
K-
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The Man With No Band
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4/2/2009 4:03:26 PM
..... or you could just marry a fox with all the right stuff .... :)
Like they say Oat P. .... "Time is Money" ... not sure I agree totally with that but ... I have NO money .... and if I used my Time properly, I could do better ...
Listen to the intro on this .... Runnin' to be Free
I did all that using "Audacity" (A free multi-track software) ... Using a Mic I made myself for less than $20.00 ... and running it through a $90.00 M-Audio preamp ...
Some of the sounds are from a $10.00 garage sale bought Casio ... some are from my $50.00 second hand bass ... some are from anything I could find around the house ... and a couple sounds are from downloaded free sounds ...
but this is where getting by on the cheap means LOTS OF TIME ... this intro was around 20 different separate tracks ... then synchronizing them and getting proper volume levels etc. etc. ... took an enormous amount of time ... I'd say all total, I probably spent over 100 hours to record 8 measures of music ...
Not very productive ... :) ... I guess what I'm trying to say is ....
DON'T BE CHEAP LIKE ME ! .... unless you have endless hours ...
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Hop On Pop
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4/2/2009 4:25:14 PM
You have an idea in your head as to how you want your recordings to sound, and that is amazing. That's a lot more than most folks have when they head into the studio.
But what I'm gonna tell you now is:
Why not RE-THINK it?!
Exercise your creativity in new ways, and figure out creative ways around your problem that gives you a feel you like, with maybe a whole new sound?
You don't have to do it, of course, but it's another direction in which to direct some of that creative thought. You'll throw a lot of the fish back, in a net spread so broadly, but you may also find some delicious morsels that you weren't planning on finding.
As a tool, to get you thinking, try this link:
Oblique Strategies
HERE is a primer on using the deck.
Just a thought from someone else struggling to afford his own studio bills.
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Otis and the Professors
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4/2/2009 10:20:17 PM
Hey everyone. Thanks a ton for all the suggestions. We are looking into all of them actually. Lots of good ideas. Todd, there is definitely some good advice there, and we are always striving to change up our sound and get creative, so maybe that would be the best route. Along those lines I remembered that we know this girl who plays violin beautifully and we are going to get her to record on this track that is almost done (almost done for about 2 months ugh!!!)
I think our main struggle now (post all your advice) is that we have one song that needs to have like an orchestra in the background. Maybe we should just shelve that idea until we can afford it. Haha.
We will tool around with all of these ideas and should have one or two new songs to post soon so you guys can see how it turns out.
Great songs btw, Kevin and Sam. Added them to the station.
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Kevin White
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4/2/2009 11:34:26 PM
---- Updated 4/2/2009 11:40:04 PM
Thanks O-
Sonar comes w/ Garritan Pocket Orchestra, just so you know. It's a very deep, feature rich program.
:^D
K-
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SILVERWOODSTUDIO
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4/3/2009 12:11:47 AM
i guess there are so many ways to approach this----
ie the studio vs the real deal (or as you say Professional violin cello flute etc) playing through an excellent mike, preferably with Phantom power-- like a Beringer
We have found most pros will play for nothing, if approached in the right way, like tell them how amazing their sound is and you just want a piece of it---you can create ALL these sounds in the studio---but they still sound like keyboards to me!!
i bet Richard Scotti has some ideas re orchestra sounds!!!!
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