| | | |
Pulse Eternal
|
2/27/2008 8:46:42 PM
---- Updated 2/27/2008 9:52:37 PM
Hearing challenge - can you pick the difference?
I have just been on the Digidesign website reading some of the articles in their 'News' section and came across a very interesting hearing challenge HERE
This particular test is something I have been very interested in for a while now. I do have an opinion of which sounds better and I am a big fan of both Protools HD and SSL! It seems that this test is a good way to check that.
The guys offering these mixes did a mix from Protools HD 192 through an SSL 4000 desk and also the same mix using Waves SSL plugins entirely in Protools (Waves SSL plugins ROCK btw!) then put up comparison files and a questionnaire where you post what you think. It then gives you a report of how you did.
I have taken the first part of the test (smooth Jazz loop) and got 6 out of 7 correct or 86%.
I'll post the rest of my results as I do the test.
Go ahead and give it a shot. Regardless of your mixing opinions, it is a fun test :-)
|
|
Pulse Eternal
|
2/27/2008 9:03:51 PM
OK, just did part two 'Smooth Jazz Continuous Challenge' and got 10 out of 13 correct for a score of 77 percent.
|
|
Pulse Eternal
|
2/27/2008 9:16:41 PM
This is FUN!!! I just did the 'Hard Rock Loop' test and got 7 out of 7 right!!!! 100 percent YAY!!!
|
|
Pulse Eternal
|
2/27/2008 9:48:12 PM
Time for the 'Hard Rock Continuous Test'...... 10 out of 13 correct or 77 percent.
I've made some notes about what I think are the biggest differences between the analog console and the Protools mixes and I'm curious to see if others agree.
Hint, you'll need monitors with extended frequency response and good transient response to pick it but I'm not going to say which end of the spectrum I am talking about until I hear some more opinions ;-)
|
|
satch
|
2/28/2008 12:10:27 AM
Titania, I would so love to do this, but our studio is all packed up for the next 5 weeks because the house is covered in scaffolding and the men are redoing the roof! There is dust, piles of it, everywhere! Horrible - but at least we'll have a better insulated roof when they are done! So much as I'd love to take the test, I don't have anywhere sensible to do it...
I might have a listen downstairs on the pc with my good cans, but I suspect that won't be anywhere near as good as using our "proper" monitors.
And I doubt whether too many iacer's will rise to the challenge, because I think a lot of the artists here don't use very good speakers anyway :)
|
|
srm
|
2/28/2008 4:12:11 AM
I take offense to that. I don't use 'very good' speakers, at all. In fact, I use horrendous speakers. That's why I use headphones. However, I intend to 'take the challenge- once I get out of the 'office', and back home. I think my biggest impediment might be my aged, abused ears rather than my playback system. But, as a Texan, I cannot shrink from a challenge.
|
|
Pulse Eternal
|
2/28/2008 4:45:17 AM
LOL Steve!! Great to see Satch has invoked a call to action!!!! :-D
I just tried the challenge with my PC's onboard sound and the difference is almost as noticeable to me even if the converters are nowhere near the quality of my main rig. Give it a shot with your good cans Satch. I think you'll be pleasantly surprised!! ....... oh, and I bet you are missing not having your studio set up.
|
|
No Rhythm
|
2/28/2008 5:02:15 AM
Well it's official, I haven't got a clue, I only listened through the pc speakers and they both sounded the same to me. Please excuse my ignorance.
Cheers Mark
|
|
Pulse Eternal
|
2/28/2008 5:05:44 AM
Sorry Mark, perhaps my previous post was a little misleading. The test I did with my PC's on board sound was not through PC speakers. It was still through my studio monitors.
I have absolutely no doubt whatsoever that I would not pick the difference on PC speakers or even typical hifi speakers.
|
|
No Rhythm
|
2/28/2008 6:12:00 AM
---- Updated 2/28/2008 6:12:00 AM
Phew, thats a relief, was thinking my hearing was going I'll have to try it again through some decent headphones.
Thanks Titania
|
|
Pulse Eternal
|
2/29/2008 5:43:10 AM
You're welcome Mark. :)
I have been trying to download the last two tests but for some reason, they just won't download. I tried on Firefox and Internet Explorer 6 on my PC and on Safari on my Mac.
Has anyone else had that trouble with the last two?
|
|
srm
|
2/29/2008 5:58:38 AM
I have to admit, I haven't even started it yet. I checked out the site, but it looked too involved for me to really get into while at work, etc. However, tonight I will have plenty of time (and beans), and will be trying my ears. I'll have to check and see if I have the same trouble with the last two 'tests'. You might drop a line to the webmaster- it might be a problem on their end, if you've been unable on several different browsers, etc.
|
|
Kevin White
|
2/29/2008 6:29:38 AM
I did two of them ... jazz and alt loops -- seems I'm a steady 5 out of 7 ... for those two genres anyways.
My impression, listening on phones, is the difference is in the low end. Frankly, I think the PT mixes have a slightly tighter bottom to them ... more definition and "edges" to the sound ... the analog is ever so slightly fuzzier -- perhaps warmer ... in comparison.
But the two are very very close ... we're talking about having to listen repeatedly and hard to discern any difference.
Kev-
|
|
Pulse Eternal
|
2/29/2008 6:45:58 AM
Kev,
That was exactly my thoughts too. The bottom end on the Protools mix is the giveaway (albeit, subtle). As well as the extra definition and faster transient response, there's also a greater extension to the lows on the Protools mix.
My educated guess as to the reasons for that would be the lack of coupling capacitors in the digital path. Coupling caps in an analog path always create some sort of roll-off and phase distortion. In a big desk like an SSL 4000, no matter how well designed they are (and they are VERY well designed) there will always be a practical limitation to the trade-offs of adding coupling capacitors. They are necessary to eliminate DC offsets and DC noise in faders and pots though.
I would be very keen to hear the same test done with a newer SSL like the 9000 K. They are DC coupled (no coupling caps) and would have a significantly tighter and deeper low end extension with a much more accurate low end phase response.
I'd say on a test like that, I wouldn't be able to pick Protools from the SSL.
|
|
Pulse Eternal
|
2/29/2008 6:47:46 AM
Steve,
I'll give the last two another try tomorrow. It could just be my internet connection and a modem reboot may fix it. If not, I'll send an email to Digidesign.
|
|
Kevin White
|
2/29/2008 6:56:58 AM
True ...
I had a tough time picking out the differences presented ... particularly on phones. It took a couple close listens to begin to get a clue about "what's different about these two pictures?"
I don't work w/ a subwoofer currently, so I didn't hear (more feel, I would think) the extended whoomph down low on the PT mixes. All I could discern oh the phones was the difference in low end definition -- which was very subtly apparent.
Kev-
|
|
Pulse Eternal
|
2/29/2008 10:35:11 PM
The subs do make it a little easier to hear. Yes, there is actually an audible difference in the low end extension.
I tried the same test with the volume low to eliminate any 'feel' factor from the subs and then turned it up to see if that feel factor helped. I actually found it easier to discern the difference at a lower level, relying on my ears only.
I'm still not able to download the last two tracks so I'll send an email to Digidesign and see if they can offer a suggestion.
|
|
srm
|
2/29/2008 11:12:02 PM
Okay, I'll be so bold as to admit that I've got no real clue. Whether it's my aged ears, or my crappy sound system, or just that the differences are too minimal to be of any real difference.
|
|
Pulse Eternal
|
3/1/2008 9:59:39 PM
You really need a very good sound system to pick the differences Steve.
We are comparing what is arguably some of the worlds finest studio equipment here.
|
|
srm
|
3/2/2008 1:42:42 AM
You mean Koss headphones from Radio Shack and Logitech speakers from KMart don't qualify?
|
|
RedRobin
|
3/2/2008 4:38:19 AM
....Hmm....Heard no difference at all in the Smooth Jazz track! Heard very strong differences in the Alt Rock track, mostly bass related but just a different feel.
Mac OS 10.5.2 > Safari > external soundcard > Mackie mixer > Event Tuned Bi-amped Direct Field Reference Monitors. I haven't bothered listening with my closed Sennheiser cans.
What's the point of this exercise?
I either like what I hear or I don't. I don't want to rack my brain analysing it, I just wanna enjoy it. :)
|
|
| |
�2015-16 IndieMusicPeople.com All Rights
Reserved
| |