it can't be done, forget about it by Noah Spaceship on The Pipeline at IndieMusicPeople

it can't be done, forget about it
Classic fighting words.

I have been racking my brains trying to figure out how to catalyze some serious reform. (as some of you are painfully aware) I am misunderstood on a regular basis, maybe because I am too loud, or crude, or simply that I skip through thoughts too quickly and blur the point I am trying to make. At any rate, here I am debating what should be my next move. Essentially my sole motivation is to be heard (not just for my own personal gain, but for the unsigned acts residing here at IAC). I have posted ideas on how to get more listeners to the artists here at IAC. I have posted ideas on etiquette (hehe, bronzed in cuss words). And although I have been online for a decade, I really haven't been on the pipeline for over 2 years (maybe longer). I have recieved more support than I actually expected, and as a result I feel like I am on the right track. These blogs I am posting, I hope remain here for a long time. I also hope that folks here take these ideas to heart and actually apply them. For the sake of our 'indie reputation' I implore you all who read these blogs to consider deeply the time you put into your art and what you wish for it to amount to. I am quite confident that as fun as this site is and the valuable friends made here, we all would like to see IAC experience a phenomenal success monitarily but moreover reputably.

My ideas have been shot down by people whom I deeply respect, and it takes me back. I have to take time to weigh their words while scribbling out back at the drawing board.

Which brings me to this blog. It aint gonna happen over night and many say it will never happen. Maybe it won't. But if any of you think I am full of shit and living a pipedream,.. well, fuck you, I don't give up that easy, and niether should you.

FU, Scott, pull your head out and get your ass back in the trenches, we need you man!!

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9/18/2009 12:04:27 AM

Here Noah, I activated this song for ya, to give you a buzz. I only had it up for a few days ever since way back when.

Time for Sayin FU

Play it loud and proud. heheh

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Noah Spaceship

9/18/2009 2:12:56 AM

Boy, the way Glen Miller played. Songs that made the hit parade.
Guys like us, we had it made.

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9/18/2009 3:13:04 AM

Okay, so tell us, in your opinion, which indie songs in particular are worth fighting for, and how do you intend to go about getting others to agree with your choices ? Or are you looking at selling the whole of indie as worthwhile ?

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Conversation Suicide

9/18/2009 3:44:10 AM

What's sad is many of us have the same goal..... it's just HOW to make it happen, and who's INDIE music is truly WORTHY.... That's what is often fought over... and HOW exactly, can we take it to the streets, in a way that opens up the FLOOD gates for the many wonderful Indie artists, on IAC, as yet mostly unknown.

I, for one, am really discouraged sometimes by the fact that most of the world doesn't want to hear new/indie, but ONLY what they've been told by the Corporate powers that be to listen to.

Even my family will admit that MUCH of what is on IAC is great stuff, but STILL chooses to listen to the "HITS" on YOUTube, Itunes, and the like, before any innovative (but quality) Indie material....

I did get them to listen to the catalog of Jim Carroll's music that is on IAC the other night, since they had heard one his tunes as a FILM soundtrack, and on the mainstream radio. But that's NOT really a victory. Before Jim passed away, he was ALREADY famous and had made a serious mark in the counter-culture; and that had NOTHING to do with his work being promoted on IAC....

-- just stream of consciousness thoughts on the whole aspect of trying to make IAC a MORE impactful site, in a world that's drowning in the Music Industry's force-feeding...

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Noah Spaceship

9/18/2009 3:47:41 AM ---- Updated 9/18/2009 3:52:44 AM

jilly brought up gordon ramsey. he has high standards and runs a harsh environment.
pro football isn't any different. many other occupations are the same.
I realize IAC aint the olympics of the indiesphere

(//edit// to answer your question, Scott)
in my opinion, I'd say the whole of indy BUT,.. the whole of indie on the internets(since your questioned is framed in such a narrow group of choices).
it's not one particular song or band, it's the battleground.
Picture the pipeline as a sacred hallowed ground.

philos stated you can't just wave a magic wand and poof.
Of course not. But what are the tools we have right here, right now?
We have a blog on a front page of a heavily enough trafficed site to warrant a higher standard. I am not talking about excessive moderation, I am talking about artists not so pussified into cowtowing to crickets.

My betterhalf tells me about an Ozzy concert she went to several years ago. Ozzy comes out, and the crowd is flipping out but Ozzy isn't pleased. Disgusted he scowls at the crowd and says, "what the fucks wrong with you people?.. I'm fucking Ozzy!" and the crowd completely loses their shit.

I know this is going over jeff's head,.. sorry dude

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Noah Spaceship

9/18/2009 3:59:28 AM

it's about the battleground, the hallowed grounds, the stage
the blogs are our stage. there is no reason we can't stir up more people.

"oh, we tried that, wah"

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Stiletto Lady

9/18/2009 4:15:52 AM ---- Updated 9/18/2009 4:16:16 AM

You got people like you wanting to stir the World's biggest pots and you got people who can hardly stir their coffee cups, you'll always end up with the LCD in life.

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satch

9/18/2009 7:03:24 AM

It all depends on the level one sets, you have to be realistic - as independent artists it is most unlikely that any of us will make "superstar" status, but nonetheless, if one is driven to create, one has no choice but to do it the best we can, in terms of recordings produced and live gigging.

The best place for us independent artists to sell our products is at our live gigs, people hear it, see it, love it, buy it - we sell most of our CD's that way. On-line sales do mount up, but they are a trickle compared with real live 3d sales!

And if you aren't a gigging band, then it's even tougher - I might go as far as to say impossible - to make it, because the web is completely clogged up, blocked, flooded, crammed, with so much music (some good, a lot of it mediocre and worse) that even if one has songs at the top of an omd chart for years and years, one is still virtually invisible!

Nonetheless, we have to keep on doing it, the songs come pouring out of us whether we like it or not - and it sure beats sitting behind a desk in an office.

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Conversation Suicide

9/18/2009 11:09:23 AM

I know you've brought out these truths before Satch, but RIGHT on.

I've had to step back from IAC just a bit, to try and get the LOCAL aspects of the band going enough to where the chance of a BROADER touring (beyond the borders of Arizona) might become a reality.

And there's so much juggling required, if you're not independently wealthy, or don't have some kind of financial backing.... so at least HALF your time still has to be spent in the ugly 9-5 world, while you burn the candle at the other end for your family and music dreams.

LOVE what you closed with: "Nonetheless, we have to keep on doing it, the songs come pouring out of us whether we like it or not - and it sure beats sitting behind a desk in an office."

I mean what are the options? Give up? Give in, and just be content in the work-a-day world? Cry, like a tiny baby?

Nah.....Gotta keep juggling it all, and Keep striving.

One of us may end up putting IAC on the map YET, and here's to hopin' it's an artist who remembers their ROOTS; one of those who keeps ties with WE who were supportive and encouraging on their way up the ladder of musical recognition.

-still workin' at it hardcore every day, and DREAMING of so much more....

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Bryon Tosoff

9/18/2009 11:19:12 AM

Terrific insight and good advice Satch....you all know and been there and know the ropes....more power to you...well done

bryon

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Phlegm

9/18/2009 11:40:29 AM ---- Updated 9/18/2009 11:43:37 AM

And what am I to ya now, Mr. Tosoff? Fuckin' Chopped Liver?

Congrats on your successes in the contest by the way, I was one of your many fans & voters.

Just thought you should know, there's more people listenin' out there than you might think.

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Bryon Tosoff

9/18/2009 11:49:21 AM ---- Updated 9/18/2009 12:10:15 PM

A slightly pissed off Phlegm fired out with a somewhat flaming rage (kinda)

"And what am I am I to ya now, Mr. Tosoff? Fuckin' Chopped Liver?

Congrats on your successes in the contest by the way, I was one of your many fans & voters.

Just thought you should know, there's more people listenin' out there than you might think."

Bryons answer to an outraged peeved dude
==============================
No Phlegm

of course not...yes I listen to your music and always love doing so...and right now am listening to music on iac....lets face it. it is way better then the crunk on radio for the most part.
I was being somewhat facetious (did I spell that right)

no you got something special dude indeed.....you are an original in a land that is a trainwreck.....you are original.....and this is not a smoke blowing contest either.
you know I mean it,.....my reviews speak for themselves on your accomplishments and stellar performances I love you music and anybody who I showcase

you are not chopped liver....you are a hard working musician performer entertainer, you have all those components that one day take you further in your career

and thank you for all your support. i really do thank you all...

You know I am only trying to bring forward the reality of the industry with no personal slam against anyone in particular in my rather backhanded comment I made

more power to you Phlegm. things will work for you, because you have the drive and determination and will to be successful.....

bryon

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Phlegm

9/18/2009 12:34:57 PM

Gawd, I hope I wasn't fishing for compliments....

Thanks Bryon-- your encouragement is one of the MANY reasons I stay with IAC, and KEEP at it, regarding the music.

now back to Noah's regularly scheduled blog..... Have a great day all you musical folks out there in Indie-Land.

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9/18/2009 12:38:41 PM

Well Noah, the reason I asked you to be specific about what songs you think are worthy is - this is where the enthusiasm comes from. Without really truly loving the music you're talking about, you're totally shooting blanks here. If you or others can't find overwhelming enthusiasm for indie acts other than yourselves, how can you expect to change the world ?

I know what I'm talking about because I've gone a long way to carry torches for numerous acts here ever since the site began. I believed that words could be contagious, that I could start a fire that would grow. But basically all I've seen is that few indies give a fuck about believing in anything outside their own page and maybe the page or 2 of some friend that gives them a boost now and then. Half the people on the pipeline don't seem to even know the whole roster of artists at IAC exist outside from the small percentage who post here. But it's a sad and true fact that most of the very best acts don't post on forums or blogs, you'll never see their faces here but far more of them are qualified to carry the indie mantel to a higher place. Most of the time the only acknowledgement we see here of some of these acts is when somebody is bitching that they never made the KIAC Big 50.

Did you ever look at the Spotlight section here ? As a parttime rock journalist I interviewed some of the greatest bands and artists indie has ever seen and a fair of them considered IAC their main site outside of their domain. I championed a number of these bands and still feel all of them are better than the current mainstream rock. Some of them, like Alphastates and Sugarplum Fairies, along with Cased, Petland, Via Audio, Minipop are way way way better than anything I've heard on mainstream radio in years. It angers me beyond belief that the names Alphastates and Sugarplum Fairies are not household names, they are that damned good. The best of the music I've heard heard at IAC is as great as any era even the ones that included the Beatles and Hendrix, and I have done all that I have the resources to do to try to help them but I don't really have any finances to speak of, I can barely pay the rent. I wrote the best articles I could for them and told everybody I know how much I love these bands. Nobody fucking cared, most didn't even listen. If they did care, I doubt they bought the CDs like I did.

It's real nice to talk in broad strokes about how we can turn around the indie dilemma. Reading your stuff Noah is reassuring in a way because its nice to see somebody flaring out in blind desire every once in awhile. But what would have to take place is for indies en masse to decide that one band is worth all of us together pushing for and everybody thinks it should be them and most couldn't name 5 indie songs they love outside of themselves or their little peer group. I've been excited, I've had this dream, and I've felt pretty alone about it, to be honest. The sad truth is unless you have money or friends in high places, online music in and of itself can't make a breakthru within the land of blogwords. But it's not the words that are the culprit, it's the lack of glowing embers in the fireplace.

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The CODE

9/18/2009 12:49:23 PM

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Noah Spaceship

9/18/2009 1:03:01 PM

I hear you , Scott, you and I have been down this road before (with you).
I refuse to air personal conversations I've had with you here, but you know.

As far as getting behind certain bands and inflating them up, I am weary of selecting any one particular act. (Utah is one of my favs here, btw - go figure how I found them, haha) I haven't checked out the spotlight section, but I will.

Well, we don't have money, and as often as I find myself agreeing with you, and as hesitant as I am to disagree with you, I have to.
I understand your fatigue, beleive me I do, and way more than I feel I want to go into detail here. I'm not going to tell you to buck up, fuck that, work that angst and despair. I promise there will be a day soon where the disapointment you are going through in light of what you perceive as failure will appear completely different.
You have an insight and gift of clarity that very very few on this planet have. IAC would not be what it is without you, I would not be here nor the dozen or so quality acts I brought with me if it was not for you, and that is a drop in the bucket compared to all of the other shit you have contributed to this site aside from the countless acts you herded onto this site.
It is not in vain.

you will see. but make no mistake, you have a place and a purpose in this universe, that much I am also certain of.

why the fuck did I get sucked back into this place?

that isn't "the" million dollar question, but once we know why, many other things will be cleared up simultaniously with a million dollar answer.
weird shit abounds

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Noah Spaceship

9/18/2009 1:06:10 PM

"The sad truth is unless you have money or friends in high places, online music in and of itself can't make a breakthru within the land of blogwords. But it's not the words that are the culprit, it's the lack of glowing embers in the fireplace."

All those in favour say:

AYE!

@code

whatever, write it off just like that. the lack of glowing embers is attitude, not circumstance.

THAT is my point

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Noah Spaceship

9/18/2009 1:12:56 PM

"The sad truth is unless you have money or friends in high places, online music in and of itself can't make a breakthru within the land of blogwords. But it's not the words that are the culprit, it's the lack of glowing embers in the fireplace."

@code and Scott

i softened up my last response, i really meant to say, BULLSHIT!!

i call bulshit, fu both!!

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Bryon Tosoff

9/18/2009 1:29:16 PM

I leave this place for now.

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The CODE

9/18/2009 2:28:15 PM

"@code and Scott

i softened up my last response, i really meant to say, BULLSHIT!!

i call bulshit, fu both!!"

*No cheap write off from this end Noah! Did B OB get into the No1
job because he had no money and friends! This is the way big
corporate State of the Union types work - Scratchy Scratchy -
Oh THAT Feels GOOD! Do it again...PLEASE...Now...My Turn!!!

BULLSHIT? Now that REALLY Works!

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9/19/2009 2:42:04 AM

I'm not fatigued, in general. I just have "lone wolf howling at the moon" syndrome. I'd like nothing more than a whole bunch of glowing people energizing the indie climate. I'll be right there with them, in full incineration mode, whenever they show up to play.

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Noah Spaceship

9/19/2009 2:48:45 AM

@code

so don't scratch my back?

...not sure what you are saying

@scott

i know you, man
howl away, brutha

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9/19/2009 4:35:15 AM

Spaceship, where's the beef?

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Noah Spaceship

9/19/2009 5:05:45 AM

auditioning for a burger commercial?

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Downsiid

9/19/2009 10:34:57 AM

You started by stating what you already understand to be true about yourself. Your in this biz for a reason, it's tough so be firm. The rollercoaster going up takes a lot more energy to get to the top. The ride down is where you just hang on and try and keep your sanity. Gotta love the music biz...

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Conversation Suicide

9/19/2009 10:36:29 AM

and I quote: "it's a LONG way to the TOP, if you wanna Rock & Roll....."

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Bryon Tosoff

9/19/2009 11:12:13 AM

Clarification

I leave this place for now. was too cryptic, some took this the wrong way sorry

i meant. I leave this place for now "for a few days" should have been inserted

bryon

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Phlegm

9/19/2009 11:26:57 AM

Nahh.... I knew we couldn't get rid of you THAT easy!

Have a good, restful and rejuvenating break, my friend.

Enjoy that time away Bryon -

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Steve April

9/19/2009 3:06:08 PM ---- Updated 9/19/2009 3:06:53 PM

"The best of the music I've heard heard at IAC is as great as any era even the ones that included the Beatles and Hendrix, and I have done all that I have the resources to do to try to help them but I don't really have any finances to speak of, I can barely pay the rent. I wrote the best articles I could for them and told everybody I know how much I love these bands."

Love that about u Scott, and I tend to agree. Salute!!!

Many of us are burning the candle at both ends. Why? Love of music, and our planet...whether anyone cares or not, the creative process is plugging in...

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